515 Crew

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/articl ... /812020360

Fuck everything.

-Joe.

yeah, i heard about that today on the radio, i honestly don't understand the rational behind it...totallly fucked up...props to the dood who help construct the shacks though....fuck that shit, the city has been fighting a battle against the homeless for years now, they have to live somewhere,


-they've tried squatting abandoned buildings...and gotten kicked out/ticketed/jailed

-they've tried tent camping- kicked out, etc.

-they've tried constructing reasonable shacks- yet again...

the shelters are full, the few that are in town...i just don't see why we cant just let em' be...
the only rationale i can think of is the fact that they aren't paying property tax for their shack space or something along those lines...
fucking annoying

Well, they better get it under control soon. I think we are going to see more and more Bushvilles in the years to come. I mean what did they really think would happen when they started tearing down the house shelters downtown? Could it have been they though suddenly the homeless would move out of Downtown?

Now with the downtown Y closing in the near future and talk of the Randolf going condo, this is only going to get worst. Instead of wasting money on studies, why not build some campgrounds with restrooms and showers for these people. Hell, put a few hundred cots inside the under used convention center.

Sadly this isn't all that strange when it comes to how we treat the homeless. The best part is the city has said it is for the safety of the people living in the shacks. Like it isn't more dangerous to be outside during the winter in Iowa sleeping in a tent.

California-nyuk, super cool to the homeless.

fuck this.

so shitty.

here's a perfect example, from the article, of the way des moines feels about the homeless:

“the city is going to act expeditiously to have them removed. They are on city property.”

do something.

does anybody remember when bums migrated with birds?

joseph wrote:does anybody remember when bums migrated with birds?

no shit, go hobo, hop on a train. being a bum in iowa where it's really hot then really cold is a bad idea.

TooManyHumyns wrote: the only rationale i can think of is the fact that they aren't paying property tax for their shack space or something along those lines...

Fuck that, if I have to pay over $2000 a year in property taxes, those fuckers should have to chip in too.


Edit: I just found out that since I'm a war vet I get $85-$100 knocked off my property taxes each year, putting me below $2000. Gotta go to the courthouse and register my DD214 now.

outlive, outlive

The majority of these guys wouldn't have to worry about a place to live if they simply went and got a J-O-B!

At the same time, if they want to camp and they don't bother anyone, who cares?

let them live at the haunted basement.

they can earn their keep by cleaning and loading in/out band gear.

El Rhino wrote:

TooManyHumyns wrote: the only rationale i can think of is the fact that they aren't paying property tax for their shack space or something along those lines...

Fuck that, if I have to pay over $2000 a year in property taxes, those fuckers should have to chip in too.


Edit: I just found out that since I'm a war vet I get $85-$100 knocked off my property taxes each year, putting me below $2000. Gotta go to the courthouse and register my DD214 now.

Then the city should put them to work to pay the rent for the land they are living on. There is plenty of trash needing to be picked up.

The worst part of the homeless situation is the cycle most of these people are in. There is a number of reasons that someone could end up on the street, mental health, drugs, boozes, or just simply losing a job. With most of American's one pay check away from the street and unemployment on the rise, it's safe to say this is something we are going to see more of. Think about it how long could most of us last on unemployment? Especially if your career no longer exists. Even if we all went to work in the services industry, who would have the money to pay for the service.

The thing is that a lot of these people are in the cycle of can't find a job cause I don't have a phone. I don't have a phone cause I don't have a residences, I don't have a residences cause I don't have a job. It may also explain why a majority of them do turn to substance abuse even if it wasn't the cause of their current situation.

Not having a phone is not an excuse for not having a job in this era of ubiquitous free internet access and free email service. It's easy to make excuses... but that's not a valid one. If you don't want to live a homeless lifestyle, you don't have to. If you don't have a substance abuse problem it's NOT hard to lift yourself out of that situation. There are social workers, agencies to help find work, etc... times are hard, but it is not difficult to scrape by.


That said, the people living in the shanty town most likely had mental health and substance abuse problems. The city should be helping these people out of the shanty town and into a support structure. Just pushing them out isn't going to solve the problem... the shanties will pop up elsewhere.

The ones with mental health problems obviously need a little help with housing and work. The ones with the substance abuse problems just need to quit whatever it is that's fucking them up and get a job. I've been homeless because of crack and meth and that's what I did. If my stupid ass can go from homeless to home owner, anyone can. The thing is, most of those guys don't want a permanent place to live. They like living the way they do and I can kind of see why. There's alot of freedom in it. They don't have to put up with any bullshit from a boss or co workers everyday. They don't have to be anywhere at any certain time. Nobody expects anything from them.

robdigi wrote:Not having a phone is not an excuse for not having a job in this era of ubiquitous free internet access and free email service. It's easy to make excuses... but that's not a valid one. If you don't want to live a homeless lifestyle, you don't have to. If you don't have a substance abuse problem it's NOT hard to lift yourself out of that situation. There are social workers, agencies to help find work, etc... times are hard, but it is not difficult to scrape by.


That said, the people living in the shanty town most likely had mental health and substance abuse problems. The city should be helping these people out of the shanty town and into a support structure. Just pushing them out isn't going to solve the problem... the shanties will pop up elsewhere.

Oh really? How many employers are going to even consider someone without a permit address or phone? I'm not sure what world you leave in but it can greatly effect if you are going to get hired. Most employers will not hire them simply because they are in transit and thus are not worth the investment in training.

Yes, there should be a support structure. However most single males, which make up a majority of homeless, will find the amount of help they have available is very limited compared to a female with children which is were the focus of most of these programs are.

DaVo wrote:

robdigi wrote:Oh really? How many employers are going to even consider someone without a permit address or phone? .

Burger King, McDonalds, etc.

Big Fat Retard wrote:The ones with mental health problems obviously need a little help with housing and work. The ones with the substance abuse problems just need to quit whatever it is that's fucking them up and get a job. I've been homeless because of crack and meth and that's what I did. If my stupid ass can go from homeless to home owner, anyone can. The thing is, most of those guys don't want a permanent place to live. They like living the way they do and I can kind of see why. There's alot of freedom in it. They don't have to put up with any bullshit from a boss or co workers everyday. They don't have to be anywhere at any certain time. Nobody expects anything from them.

Good for you. The question I have though is what kind of support system did you have that allowed you over come your problems?

Most of these people have no support system. Often do to their abuse problems. I'm not saying that it's impossible to pull yourself up by your bootstraps but it is not something that happens often. In fact over coming addiction has a lower success rate then the Chicago Cubs. The programs maybe be there but how effective are they and how stressed are they?

As far as just being an anti-social lazy fucking ass bum goes, fuck em. The cost of that freedom is sleeping on the cold ass streets. If you want a better life get a fucking job.

Good for the city!

Do something to get yourself off of my payroll or get the fuck out....or die. Preferably die.

Big Fat Retard wrote:

DaVo wrote:

robdigi wrote:Oh really? How many employers are going to even consider someone without a permit address or phone? .

Burger King, McDonalds, etc.

Yes, maybe but who do you think they are going to hire? A 25 year old transit with no employment record for over 6 months, no transportation, no permit address or phone or a 16 year high school student that lives in their parents house, has a home number and a cel phone and a car.

As an employer who do you think is going to show up for work every day and is going to be working for there longer then 6 months?

Due to the rise in unemployment, you are going to see a lot of people in the market looking for temporary jobs. It will push younger job applicants and transits out of paper hat jobs. I experienced first hand in the 80s.

It's not like a homeless person can be expected to get a GREAT or even GOOD job right off the streets, but shitty work pays too.

Your unsubstantiated fast food anecdote doesn't hold up... fast food franchises still employ mentally challenged and impoverished people. To do otherwise is discrimination. Again, Mr. Recovering Crack Addict is not going to be running the drive thru at the Jordan Creek Wendy's, but there are still places that will have him.

Also, panhandlers in a city can easily make enough money in one day to afford a prepaid cell phone.

robdigi wrote:It's not like a homeless person can be expected to get a GREAT or even GOOD job right off the streets, but shitty work pays too.

Your unsubstantiated fast food anecdote doesn't hold up... fast food franchises still employ mentally challenged and impoverished people. To do otherwise is discrimination. Again, Mr. Recovering Crack Addict is not going to be running the drive thru at the Jordan Creek Wendy's, but there are still places that will have him.

Also, panhandlers in a city can easily make enough money in one day to afford a prepaid cell phone.

First off, I'm not sure but there is no law that states that an employer can not discriminate based on being poor and I think you should look a little harder at how the law would define mental disability and if they are in fact qualified for the job. For example, I'm dyslexic but I doubt I could win a law suit against the Des Moines Register for not hiring me to be a text proof reader. Cause I'm not qualified and my mental disability would effect my ability to do the job. Also mental illness and mental disability are defined differently under the law. As far as qualification goes many employers list permit residence in their policies as a qualification. I don't think this has ever been tested in a law suit but you would be hard pressed to judge that would consider this an unfair or discrimination.

As someone that as been blessed enough to never have to pan handle to survive, I really don't know what an average person could make at it in Downtown. I doubt it is really that much and if I was in that situation food and shelter would be a lot higher on the list then a pre-paid cell phone.

That all said, maybe the focus of this new shelter should be supplying access to a mail box, internet, and phone. It seems like it would only make sense but like most band aid programs, I'm sure it's more about how many can we put up for the night and how will it effect property values.

this problem is obviously very simple to fix and someone with great insight like Joey Chaos or Johnny Reeferseed will be able fix it.

a great percentage of the homeless population have mental illnesses. and if you've ever been around someone with a real mental illness, you'll understand that an option like "get a job" is not viable.

and fact is, why is it our country and culture makes it illegal to live? i think it's a shame that people are forced to labor. i always thought and was told we work so we can have things, do for ourselves financially. if someone is okay (or they believe it's their only choice) with having nothing and just living or scrapping for meals and possessions, why are we so opposed?
and before you start in with the "it's my taxes" argument, these people obviously weren't using tax dollars by being in a shelter, they were doing the opposite: doing for themselves.

Joey Chaos wrote:Good for the city!

Do something to get yourself off of my payroll or get the fuck out....or die. Preferably die.

These guys are off your payroll. They don't live in the shelters that are funded by your tax money. They don't collect food stamps or any of that other stuff. They make their own way and buy their own food and beer. If they aren't bothering anyone why is it good for the city to run them off?

DaVo wrote:Yes, maybe but who do you think they are going to hire? A 25 year old transit with no employment record for over 6 months, no transportation, no permit address or phone or a 16 year high school student that lives in their parents house, has a home number and a cel phone and a car.

As an employer who do you think is going to show up for work every day and is going to be working for there longer then 6 months?

Due to the rise in unemployment, you are going to see a lot of people in the market looking for temporary jobs. It will push younger job applicants and transits out of paper hat jobs. I experienced first hand in the 80s.

I walked into a Burger King on Hennepin Ave in Minneapolis the day I got out of prison and got a job. I was totally straight with them and told them I got out of prison that morning and I needed a job. Their only question was "can you start today?" The moral to the story is that anyone can get a job if they want. They may have to humble themselves and scrub the floors underneath the booths at BK, but that's the way it goes.

Big Fat Retard wrote: These guys are off your payroll. They don't live in the shelters that are funded by your tax money. They don't collect food stamps or any of that other stuff. They make their own way and buy their own food and beer. If they aren't bothering anyone why is it good for the city to run them off?

I bet they go to Broadlawns.

ilikehorses wrote:thiand before you start in with the "it's my taxes" argument, these people obviously weren't using tax dollars by being in a shelter, they were doing the opposite: doing for themselves.

Obviously. I bet they go to Broadlawns.

El Rhino wrote:

Big Fat Retard wrote: These guys are off your payroll. They don't live in the shelters that are funded by your tax money. They don't collect food stamps or any of that other stuff. They make their own way and buy their own food and beer. If they aren't bothering anyone why is it good for the city to run them off?

I bet they go to Broadlawns.

I bet you're right. Got me there.

robdigi wrote: Also, panhandlers in a city can easily make enough money in one day to afford a prepaid cell phone.

Register just had an article on this last week...apparently the panhandlers who reguraly frequent the merle hay exit make about $10-20 an hour on most days (working in 4 hour shifts).

Jazzcop wrote:

robdigi wrote: Also, panhandlers in a city can easily make enough money in one day to afford a prepaid cell phone.

Register just had an article on this last week...apparently the panhandlers who reguraly frequent the merle hay exit make about $10-20 an hour on most days (working in 4 hour shifts).

lol, I believe it. My taxation teacher told us about a guy in New York who played the subways everyday. Just took a guitar down with a little amp and mic- left his case open for money. This guy lived in the suburbs and drove a BMW- and had two kids in college. He was making over $80,000 a year (all from subway performance) He neglected to pay any sort of income tax on it (for around 10 years), the IRS found out and nailed him for somewhere around $100k......dude paid it off in cash in one payment.