515 Crew

with Deals Gone Bad in Sept
would you go?
$10-12?
thanks

Not for $12.

-Joe.

Maybe if Mustard Plug doesn't show up.

-1

i'd probably go. never seen them live before.


but i also said i was gonna go to the show tonight......and here i am taking a break from cleaning the pond out of my basement...... SKA SKA SKA

I wouldn't go, I've seen them before, it wasn't that great, and I never liked them in the first place. Joe apparently doesn't know how expensive touring is when gas is 4-5 bucks a gallon. Sorry dude, shows aren't always gonna be 5 bucks, try not to cry.

I probably maybe might go.

Joey Chaos wrote:Joe apparently doesn't know how expensive touring is when gas is 4-5 bucks a gallon. Sorry dude, shows aren't always gonna be 5 bucks, try not to cry.

I book shows constantly now for out ot town bands and go on tours. I know how expensive gas is.
Mustard Plug isn't worth $12 to me, you dumb fucker.
I'll gladly pay $12 and more for Streetlight Manifesto or Less Than Jake or someone I really like, just not Mustard Plug.

Dip-fucking-shit.

-Joe.

Attn long haired faggot. You bitch about every single show posted with a door price of more than 5 bucks. It wouldn't matter who it was, you'd still cry about it.

I would see them. They are from my home state, are cool guys, and play decent music. Prefer it to be $10.

Joey Chaos wrote:Attn long haired faggot. You bitch about every single show posted with a door price of more than 5 bucks. It wouldn't matter who it was, you'd still cry about it.

Shows should not be more than $5. If they are, it better be someone really really really good. Of course the whole time I think to myself, do these people really need this much money?

If you are into making music for money, you are into it for the wrong reasons.

stfu hippie. some people are older and have adult lives that require a bit than gas money to sustain.

Lets say gas is 4 bucks a gallon, and an average van loaded with gear gets 12 mpg (and thats being generous). A band plays for 50 kids at 5 bucks a head. After the venue takes 100 bucks for their expenses (average), that leaves the band with 150 bucks. Say they spend 25 of that to feed themselves, that leaves 125. That's about 30 gallons of gas. Better hope their shows are all close together, and they only need to eat once a day. Oh, and I bet you didn't know it costs almost 17 bucks in tolls to get acrossed Pennsylvania did you? Or how about when you have to replace a fuel line in an auto parts store parking lot in Indiana (I did)? after buying tools and the line, that was twenty bucks down the drain. How about bottled water? It's hot as fuck in a van full of dudes in the summer, and ac kills gas mileage? There are all kinds of things that just come up. Showers? Even you stinky fuckers have to take one every once in a while to avoid getting sick. Plan on getting a hotel room atleast one night or paying 5 bucks a member at a flying J, because people who are willing to let your whole band use their shower/couches are a lot less common than you think. How about when the screw falls out of your guitar and you have to buy wood dough, or when your strap breaks? Cause both happened to me? Drummer runs out of sticks? Huh? Huh? What about that? What about when you're in the mountains and its cold and someone loses their sleeping bag? Huh? How about when the venue you're playing at tells you you'll get a shitty portion of the door, but they'll feed you, then when you get there, you find out their was a misunderstanding on the food thing, and your shit out of luck, and after the show they hand you 40 bucks?

And on top of all that, Crow is right, people have bills. If I wanted to go on tour right now, I would have to figure something out to cover my house payment and all the other stuff. But ignoring this part, 5 bucks is not enough with gas prices like they are.

All of you who have never been on a tour (three shows in Iowa doesn't count) and don't know what you're talking about need to shut the fuck up.

Thom wrote:

Joey Chaos wrote:Attn long haired faggot. You bitch about every single show posted with a door price of more than 5 bucks. It wouldn't matter who it was, you'd still cry about it.

Shows should not be more than $5. If they are, it better be someone really really really good. Of course the whole time I think to myself, do these people really need this much money?

If you are into making music for money, you are into it for the wrong reasons.

some shows should be more than 5 bucks. i would think anything at a venue not a house would be more. a venue has employees and rent. out of town bands need money(hence donations at house shows). 5 dollar shows are cool but as im sure davo will point out theyve been on average 5 bucks since the early 80s. minimum wage has doubled(pretty sure) since then

Joey Chaos wrote:Lets say gas is 4 bucks a gallon, and an average van loaded with gear gets 12 mpg (and thats being generous). A band plays for 50 kids at 5 bucks a head. After the venue takes 100 bucks for their expenses (average), that leaves the band with 150 bucks. Say they spend 25 of that to feed themselves, that leaves 125. That's about 30 gallons of gas. Better hope their shows are all close together, and they only need to eat once a day. Oh, and I bet you didn't know it costs almost 17 bucks in tolls to get acrossed Pennsylvania did you? Or how about when you have to replace a fuel line in an auto parts store parking lot in Indiana (I did)? after buying tools and the line, that was twenty bucks down the drain. How about bottled water? It's hot as fuck in a van full of dudes in the summer, and ac kills gas mileage? There are all kinds of things that just come up. Showers? Even you stinky fuckers have to take one every once in a while to avoid getting sick. Plan on getting a hotel room atleast one night or paying 5 bucks a member at a flying J, because people who are willing to let your whole band use their shower/couches are a lot less common than you think. How about when the screw falls out of your guitar and you have to buy wood dough, or when your strap breaks? Cause both happened to me? Drummer runs out of sticks? Huh? Huh? What about that? What about when you're in the mountains and its cold and someone loses their sleeping bag? Huh? How about when the venue you're playing at tells you you'll get a shitty portion of the door, but they'll feed you, then when you get there, you find out their was a misunderstanding on the food thing, and your shit out of luck, and after the show they hand you 40 bucks?

And on top of all that, Crow is right, people have bills. If I wanted to go on tour right now, I would have to figure something out to cover my house payment and all the other stuff. But ignoring this part, 5 bucks is not enough with gas prices like they are.

All of you who have never been on a tour (three shows in Iowa doesn't count) and don't know what you're talking about need to shut the fuck up.

that is wayy too much for this dumb argument.
i'm going to side with joe on this, that it's not worth 12 bucks to see mustard plug. they have one song i like, they probably wouldn't play it, besides, i have the cd.
and there are other sources of money while on tour, such as merch. and if money is that tight, bands can put out a donation jar and get twenty+ bucks that way. yeah, touring sucks. i'm pretty sure everyone knows that. it hasn't started sucking recently. every band ever that has had to tour in a van, driving from shitty bar to shitty bar has agreed that is sucks and doesn't pay well. and unfortunately, if you are in music for the money, you are in it for the wrong reason, adult or not. because chances are, you will never make a single dollar doing it, you will only lose money. that is the sad truth of music.

Thom wrote:
Shows should not be more than $5. If they are, it better be someone really really really good. Of course the whole time I think to myself, do these people really need this much money?
.

LOL.


I hope your boss asks himself "Does Thom really need this much money?" when it comes time to pay you for the things you do (if you're employed) and I also hope your wage never increases for the next 20 years or so, despite rising costs of living.

Didn't you ban yourself or something here a few months ago?

If you don't like em, don't go. I don't like em, and I'm not going. That doesn't mean they're not worth that much money. Just because we don't like them, doesn't mean there's not 1000 kids out there that do.

ilikehorses wrote:and unfortunately, if you are in music for the money, you are in it for the wrong reason, adult or not. because chances are, you will never make a single dollar doing it, you will only lose money. that is the sad truth of music.

there's a difference between "in it for the money" and trying to make enough money to continue to be able to do it.

Exactly. Just because you're not out to make money, doesn't mean you shouldn't break even.

Joey, I can think of way easy explanations to pay for all of the things you wrote that don't result in some kid paying 12 dollars to see suburban scum. I am fully aware of all of the things you brought up, and my thoughts have not been altered in any way. If you want to charge $100 for someone to see some band you're in go for it. I won't be attending.

El Rhino wrote:
LOL.


I hope your boss asks himself "Does Thom really need this much money?" when it comes time to pay you for the things you do (if you're employed) and I also hope your wage never increases for the next 20 years or so, despite rising costs of living.

Didn't you ban yourself or something here a few months ago?

Today is the day is a prime example of this. They are fucking grown men playing rock star. They obviously think they are worth some hot shit because they have a Revolver magazine banner behind them while they are touring. Fuck that. I don't care how well they played, it was not a 12 dollar performance. The promoter was forced to pay out of pocket so that they could further inflate their egos. This does nothing to further a DIY community, it actually does the opposite.

Unless you are selling fucking multi-platinum records and playing fucking stadiums you are playing small venues where people put everything they have into it. It's not someone's job, it's someone's passion. Bands with outrageous monetary demands make it hard for people to continue doing this. The more venues bands like Today Is The Day and Gaza sink because they think they are Van Halen, the less places small bands have to play.

Also, I have a job and shower daily. I'm fine with the pay rate that I have right now.

I would never ask someone to pay that much to see Suburban Scum, because our average draw was 30-60 kids. If it was 500-1000, it would be a different story.

Joey Chaos wrote:I would never ask someone to pay that much to see Suburban Scum, because our average draw was 30-60 kids. If it was 500-1000, it would be a different story.

Exactly. I'm not asking anyone to starve. I just think that there are better ways for bands to sustain themselves without raping venues and communities. More reasonable prices for shows and no guarantees can create a more sustainable DIY community.

Mustard Plug is not going to draw 500-1000 kids.
Mustard Plug isn't going to draw 100.
Not even 50.

-Joe.

Thom wrote:Today is the day is a prime example of this. They are fucking grown men playing rock star. They obviously think they are worth some hot shit because they have a Revolver magazine banner behind them while they are touring. Fuck that. I don't care how well they played, it was not a 12 dollar performance. The promoter was forced to pay out of pocket so that they could further inflate their egos. This does nothing to further a DIY community, it actually does the opposite.

.

today is the day is the worst example you could come up with.

their shows have consistently been 12 bucks nationally for 8 years or so.
and 12 bucks for the PACKAGE show was a cheap deal. it sucks that nate had to pay out of pocket but if you ask him he'll be staying clear of that kind of package deal for awhile. i think part of his reasoning to book it was to bring something to dsm that people usually travel to see. i paid to get into that show. it was not my cup of coffee at all. i was curious so i went.
he also paid out of pocket for thrones. im sure every promoter/booker has paid out of pocket. id bet joe does it regularly

joseph wrote: today is the day is the worst example you could come up with.

their shows have consistently been 12 bucks nationally for 8 years or so.
and 12 bucks for the PACKAGE show was a cheap deal. it sucks that nate had to pay out of pocket but if you ask him he'll be staying clear of that kind of package deal for awhile. i think part of his reasoning to book it was to bring something to dsm that people usually travel to see. i paid to get into that show. it was not my cup of coffee at all. i was curious so i went.
he also paid out of pocket for thrones. im sure every promoter/booker has paid out of pocket. id bet joe does it regularly

The point I'm making more is that there is a big difference when a promoter pays out of pocket voluntarily because its the courteous thing to do, and it is an acceptable loss....and when a band FORCES a promoter to pay out of pocket.

I know we are all a lot smarter than this argument. I'm bored of it already. no one's opinion is going to change.

Aside from monetary issues, Today Is The Day was not good. I think Mouth Of The Architect was redeeming however.

crow wrote:

ilikehorses wrote:and unfortunately, if you are in music for the money, you are in it for the wrong reason, adult or not. because chances are, you will never make a single dollar doing it, you will only lose money. that is the sad truth of music.

there's a difference between "in it for the money" and trying to make enough money to continue to be able to do it.

i know that. but that's not what thom said that caused joey to get (more) bent out of shape.

I bet there's 100 people if they play.

You think people give a shit about ska?
No one was at the show last night.

100 won't show.

-Joe.

Thom wrote: More reasonable prices for shows and no guarantees can create a more sustainable DIY community.

Nigga, please. Find me any other circuit in the world where you can have someone travel from hundreds of miles away to entertain your ass along with ten of your buddies in a basement for $5 a head.

Maybe the problem isn't these greedy bands who want enough gas money to get from point A to the next pack of jerkoffs in another state, maybe some money to get some food that isn't ramen noodles and other touring expenses... Maybe the problem is you and your unwillingness to give up your resources for "sustainable DIY communities". Remember, you get what you pay for.

Mustard Plug is a way bigger band than the ones that played last night. I booked the Suicide Machines and well over 100 people cared. I'm not comparing the two directly, since SM are bigger, but they are both rather mainstream bands, and the style is very similar. 100 people won't show, only because the Mews idea of promoting is putting it on the website and putting one flier in the window, but if it was promoted properly, there would be that many or more.